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 The Black Mountain (1954) 
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New post The Black Mountain (1954)
You're invited to use this topic to discuss the quotations from The Black Mountain (1954) – a Nero Wolfe novel by Rex Stout.

You may also use this thread for general discussions about this literary work; you do not necessarily need to discuss specific quotations.

Or, if you'd like to talk about anything else related to Nero Wolfe, Archie Goodwin, or Rex Stout, feel free to create a new discussion topic.


Last edited by Faterson on Fri, 27 Jul 2007, 6:35, edited 1 time in total.

Sat, 21 Jul 2007, 13:03
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New post Murder It Yourself
Thank you for fixing my cross-reference with Plot It Yourself! :D I wouldn't normally bother about such inconsistencies, but this one annoyed me as I found the Black Mountain version to be much more in-character for Wolfe - he doesn't bellow in his mother tongue, or start thumping the desk, he just sits quietly and has to struggle to keep his features in check. I also liked Archie breaking off in his own subtle distress, too, either for Marko or in sympathy with Wolfe.

I have other quotes, if you would care to do the sourcing? I borrowed a reading copy from the British Library, and didn't make note of edition or page numbers when I dissected it :?

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Sat, 21 Jul 2007, 15:57
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New post Re: Murder It Yourself
AdonisGuilfoyle wrote:
I have other quotes, if you would care to do the sourcing?

By all means, go ahead :!: Here's where an electronic version of the text of The Black Mountain would come in handy for us, but I'll try just to use my eyes on my paperback edition to locate your quotes.

If I fail to find the sourcing for some of your quotes right away, that's no tragedy. :wink: Anyone else can fill in that information later on. If I get really mad, I'll simply scan the entire text of The Black Mountain on my scanner, and OCR software would then locate your quotes for us. :D (Only as a measure of last resort, of course.) :)


Sat, 21 Jul 2007, 16:18
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Added! I haven't gone overboard this time, but I also realised that chapter and page references were the least of my worries when I started - I can barely remember the story! Sorry! I've added pointless - though I hope correct, in the main - captions, just to space out the quotes, but you may be able to expand on my input, if you have the book to hand. For instance, I've tagged one description of Wolfe as his reception of the news that Carla has also been killed, but I'm not sure if I've got it right. Rearrange as necessary if that's a spoiler (everyone knows she is killed, right - like Marko, and Johnny Keems?)

I also liked how the knife that Wolfe uses as a letter-opener in Plot It Yourself comes from The Black Mountain - at least Stout remembered that detail correctly! :roll:

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Sat, 21 Jul 2007, 21:12
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Thanks a lot for posting these, Adonis :!: I'll be devoting myself to The Black Mountain quotations in the next few days, adding my own quotes and trying to locate what chapters/pages your quotes come from. 8)

PS: Yeah, I may be including a few spoiler warnings. Please bear with me, over spoiler warnings and the 100% linguistic accuracy and authenticity. They seem to be my fetishes. :roll: :oops: :P

(Not so sure everyone knows about those guys and gals getting killed. We can get away with disclosing MV's murder, though, as it occurs on the opening pages of a novel.) :wink:


Last edited by Faterson on Sun, 22 Jul 2007, 14:41, edited 1 time in total.

Sat, 21 Jul 2007, 21:20
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Adonis, I've been pretty successful thus far in locating your quotes. :wink: I've now revised the first 6 out of 15; and I'll be adding 15 of my own quotes to this collection. (Perhaps there'll be an overlap between your and my quotes, and perhaps there'll be none.) :)

I've decided not to flag Carla's death as a spoiler. :D It occurs too early into the novel (chapter 3) to be really considered a spoiler. The same goes for Marko.

As to Johnny, I believe that's a bit different. Although most Wolfe readers are aware he somehow disappeared from among the other cast members at some point, how and when it happened is not known to most Wolfe readers, unless they read a certain Wolfe novel. Plus, that death occurs pretty late into the action of that particular novel, and is among the central elements of that novel's plot. So, should there be any specific quotations related to Johnny's demise, I'll be flagging them as spoilers. 8)

All of this is no big deal, anyway, is it? :)

(I should perhaps add Please forgive my fetishes as my signature line for this forum...) :roll:


Sun, 22 Jul 2007, 14:39
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New post Johnny, we're sorry
Faterson wrote:
As to Johnny, I believe that's a bit different. Plus, that death occurs pretty late into the action of that particular novel, and is among the central elements of that novel's plot. So, should there be any specific quotations related to Johnny's demise, I'll be flagging them as spoilers. 8)


How does that spoiler alert work? SPOILER ahead! :wink: I didn't think Johnny's death was particularly 'central', when I read Might As Well Be Dead - I thought it was a lazy way of writing out a character, albeit a moderately unpleasant one, and that Stout wasn't overly faithful to the character (again). And what was that tacked-on line about a wife? Orrie marrying Jill Hardy after Doxy is one thing, I've always thought Orrie was not as bad as Stout had Archie paint him, but Johnny was the original conceited, oily, unpleasant 'impostor' - he should have remained a bachelor, in my opinion, playing the field but never getting 'caught', and with perhaps a grieving mother to mourn his death, but not a wife! After all, whereas Wolfe can stand Orrie enough to have him work in the office when Archie is unavailable, he once warned Johnny not to try imitate Archie, as he wouldn't make it! (Black Orchids) :P

It irks me when Stout doesn't follow through with character backstories - mainly on the part of Saul, who is married with kids, I don't think, and then he isn't (which fits). Actually, Stout can be rather lazy overall. A minor grievance of mine - as discussed with Danielle - is that all the characters have either 'sharp grey' eyes, or 'dark' eyes. I'm of the opinion that Archie should have brilliant blue eyes, like Timothy Hutton, to stand out from Cramer et al :wink:

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Sun, 22 Jul 2007, 19:44
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Adonis, in addition to limited eye color, most characters wear brown, sometimes in conjunction with green!
It really can't get much worse than that. :roll:

A question, is this thread for quotations only? Do we have a place to comment on BM as a whole and in general ?


Tue, 24 Jul 2007, 3:15
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starfish wrote:
A question, is this thread for quotations only? Do we have a place to comment on BM as a whole and in general ?

No, this thread is not just for discussing the quotations. Any comments on the novel as such are welcome. I should perhaps rephrase the standard wording at the top of each thread to indicate that. :? I'll think about revising the wording soon. 8)


Tue, 24 Jul 2007, 13:08
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New post The Black Mountain
What I like most about this novel is the atypical Wolfe-at-large (no pun intended).
Normally, when he has to leave the Brownstone and navigate the wilds of NY, he does not do so easily.
It is Archie's responsibility to get him from point A to point B and eventually, safely home again. Wolfe confines himself to being quarrelsom, complaining and difficult.
Not so here. Wolfe is in his element. He functions naturally and on his own. Archie is the fish out of water.
Wolfe knows the language, the political realities, the culture and the land. Archie depends on Wolfe's knowhow for his survival. That is quite a role reversal.
And Wolfe is an absolute marvel of resourcefulness, courage and endurance.


Sat, 28 Jul 2007, 3:11
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New post Re: The Black Mountain
starfish wrote:
That is quite a role reversal.

Indeed. :) We even have a specific quotation to illustrate what you're saying; when Adonis Guilfoyle was uploading it, she in fact tagged the excerpt as Role reversal in the description field. Check out the quote from chapter 4, page 35.


Sat, 28 Jul 2007, 4:30
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New post Re: The Black Mountain
starfish wrote:
What I like most about this novel is the atypical Wolfe-at-large (no pun intended).
Wolfe is in his element. He functions naturally and on his own. Archie is the fish out of water.
Archie depends on Wolfe's knowhow for his survival. That is quite a role reversal.
And Wolfe is an absolute marvel of resourcefulness, courage and endurance.


I liked this novel only for the strengthened bond between Archie and Wolfe; Archie could be said to be more of a hindrance than a help to Wolfe in the beginning, yet Wolfe still brings him along, and of course Archie gets to prove his worth later in the story.

Goodwingrad has said that she thinks Stout was intentionally killing off the only other two people who were really close to Wolfe - Marko, his childhood friend, and Carla, his adopted daughter - to show that Archie is the only important figure in his life, and I would agree. Wolfe avenges their deaths, but he can and does continue his life without them - I'm sure that Archie's death would have had a far greater impact on him.

There's a neat line in one of the novelettes, I forget the title, where Archie insists that he is merely an errand boy, or a caddy - and Marko replies, 'I know how deep you go, my friend'. Wolfe has a sense of obligation towards both Marko and Carla, but they are merely satellites in his orbit, like Fritz and Lewis Hewitt and Cramer - Archie is, as has been said, 'part of him'. And in Black Mountain, Wolfe decides that Archie shall be 'Alex', his son, and he makes a couple of pointed comments about wishing that his associates in Albania could communicate with Archie - he is obviously very proud of him, and I doubt he could function without his help. Likewise for Archie, of course, as also shown in this novel :wink:

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Sat, 28 Jul 2007, 11:52
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New post Black Mountain
Being a johnny-come-lately, I did not realize that a BM discussion is already underway. Sorry if I parroted previous observations.
I have to re-read. Unlike the other books, I read BM only once. It is quite scary in spots. I even had to close my eyes a few times. :) But all is well that ends well - and this ended very well indeed, with Archie back in charge of security. :D


Sun, 29 Jul 2007, 1:21
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